MPACUK - Two Murdered in Tooting
A guest article on the gang situation in Tooting, south London, which led to the murder of two (Muslim) brothers a few weeks ago:
The Pakistani gangs in Tooting are the leaders and strongest in numbers and violence. They have a reputation that they have built over the past two decades. It stems from armed robberies to extortion and gang violence. The life on the street for any gang member revolves around one strong principle. That is "rep", the reputation of a man on the street is everything. It is what he is known by, it is his degree, his M.A and Ph.D. His respect is built on his rep and he will kill to protect his rep.
very interesting and that coulndt be any more different than the Pakistanis in NYC who are the meekest of the meek.
Part of the problem is the macho culture. Women have no role at all in this gang culture, but in healthy societies, women provide a counterbalance and stability for men.
I'm not say this about Pakistanis or Muslims; I mean gang culture generally, like the mafia or the yardies, and this lot. It's a throwback to tribal times.
Poor mother to have lost both her sons.
Umar,
I tell you America needs to stop exporting its gang culture. And they say these Muslims hate the West.
On another note, this is what happens when you follow in the footsteps of the disbelievers. Oh sorry, I am not supposed to go there.
Isnt that true. I know my husband knows a few Pakistani brothers at the uni near our home and they do strike me as being very meek. Stereotypically meek almost effeminent.
Umar & Bikhair: in this country there are a lot of Asian kids involved in crime, including Pakistanis. A lot of Pakistani kids have gone in for the gangsta culture and mix their Hindi slang with Afro street slang (you can find examples in the recently published novel *Londonistani*). The older generations might be meek, although less so here than in the US. In many places here they had to deal with pressure from racists who were often violent. And possibly US black gang culture appeals to any disaffected and non-white youths - notice its appeal to Lebanese youths in Australia who were involved in the riots last December.
Gang culture is all over the place, not just America. And it happens amongst white people just as much as blacks and Asians. Look at the mafia. Also in Russia there are gangs. And China.
And it is a macho thing, where men have no role models and don't treat women as equals.
And it is a macho thing, where men have no role models and don't treat women as equals.
There are women in gangs in Italy and Colombia (if you count FARC as a gang) for example.
there is a big difference between the mafia and street gangs; street gangs terrorize innocent people living in the areas and mafias quietly go about their business.
Asians here are not forming gangs, in part in my opinion because the gang scene here is much tougher and violent and everyone has guns. Blacks and Latinos still dominate street gangs.
When I was younger though you had Irish gangs like the Westies and before that their were Italian gangs ( not the mafia).
bring back national service see how these gangs desperse. soft law makes hard criminals, blame the law makers not society
Dear Mr. Reader,
Mr. Muhammad Ali and Mr. Hayder Ali are the sons of the son (Shahid Mirza) of my first cousin Mirza Makhdum Ali Baig. It is surprising to learn that certain writers on 'tooting murders' suspect 'hindoo tamil street gang' having murdered both the brothers. On the contrary, sonny Imran Mirza emailed me to the effect that Pakistani Street Gang are the culprits. Also, I have been gven to understand that trial of rather 12 arrests (Pakistanis) would start in January next. Please let me know the factual position per return email. I hope, you would be kind enough to keep me informed of any further development from time to time.
aggrieved
syed asghar ali
631-E-1, M. A. Johar Town,
Lahore 54770 - Pakistan
Cell: 0334-4376810
Do parents know what their children are up to? Do parents know their children are involved incrime? Because I would say; parents have a role in the upbringing of their children, giving guidance helping to give direction in life, values etc. This 'gang' problem is has partly arisen because of the parents; highly likely to be first generation immigrants to this country; have no idea how things operate in this country; probably from the village; bringing that tribal mentality over to this country anf transfering it to the children
http://archive.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/2007/7/19/199819.html
Using the above link you will see a story about 2 asian pakistani gangs that have been feuding on and off the whole of this decade in a small West Yorkshire town by the name of Keighley. When the level of violence is raised it is a terrifying place to live. 4 young Asians were killed in tit-tat gang attacks at the start of the decade, this sin't a city but a small town wit a population of about 40 000, things seemed to calm down but have picked up again violent attacks by the gangs on each other are almost daily but the issue is that both gangs are Pakistani gangs so do gangs really care about race or religion when all they lives are based around organized and street crime drug dealing money laundering and so on these are the reasons for the hate they have
Umar Lee Pakistanis dont speak hindi they speak urdu or pashtun and the London slang is alot different then the slang in the US same as Australia so you cant compare the two. Some people are ignorant in this issue assuming that whoever is involved in gangs are copying the black people in America which is entirely wrong because Gangs have been existent for thousands of years probably even from the beginning of time only difference is that they were called Tribes back then. Just like Old Pickler has said Boys will be Boys its all about about the machismo. It wasnt the Blacks that started crime. Thousands of years ago Tribes in Arabia would loot passing caravans they had a mentality of who is the biggest and baddest in the land they would merely kill eachother for one looking at another one sword to sword until the Prophet Mohammed came and changed all that made them more civilized. Then you saw the Italian Mafia gangs that established and this was all before the origin of Black Gangs in US even the Hispanic Gang culture dates way back before Black the only reason why Blacks are so famous for crime is because of their Rap Music which flourished among the youth. And Umar Lee its not the fact that Latinos and Blacks are more violent then Pakistanis it is because theres way more numbers of them in America just as there is more Pakistanis in UK and more Moroccan arabs in France and more Lebanese in Australia that is why their presence is more widely felt. If you study into Crime in the US you will find there is a couple Palestinian and other Arab Organized criminal clans but they are on the low low because there is not many of them there but if u go down to Australia or some European countries you will find that the Arabs are the most powerful criminal force down there at the moment. Just as Pakistanis along side Moroccans and Kurds/Turks are the most Powerful in UK.
what a waste for many peoples lives.I have just heard that some of those people involved have been sentenced who were involved in this crime.
families are ruined >not just the family who have lost there children .
But also those families whose children were involved or were presence.. 25-30 yrs sentenced the parnets are in despair as there childrens lives are ruined and i know one is married and has his wife abroad still waiting to come over to london now she cant come her life is ruined .. the anguish if only people would consider what this has done to many people.
Some of the people who went down were entirely innocent like the person who has a wife abroad. The Wimbledon gang have lied blatanly and are getting away with it please check this site www.tootinginjustice.blogspot.com the truth is in there these brothers died through their own misdeeds...