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	<title>Comments on: More on the niqab situation</title>
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	<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation</link>
	<description>Politics, tech and media issues from a Muslim perspective</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 00:36:00 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Hazera Forth</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4158</link>
		<dc:creator>Hazera Forth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Dec 2006 16:49:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4158</guid>
		<description>Mike - please take a moment to read my email again because you will notice the word &quot;if&quot; - I was trying to demonstrate to you that people can be upset by the merest difference in opinion and language.  I was NOT saying that women who where make-up and mini-skirts are whores but was asking how people would react if I were to do so because that is exactly how I felt about Polly Toynbee saying that the Niqab is oppressive and sinister.  Words have a lot of power, Mr Martlet, so before you tell me to go back to where I came from, try reading my email properly and within the context I wrote it.  I could ask you where you are from?  Do you know?

Here is the text to which you refer:

&quot;...IF I were to say that all women who wear make-up, high-heels and mini-skirts are whores and bound to be raped, perhaps many might feel I was a) a prude b) unsophisticated or c) unable to comprehend a woman&#039;s sense of fashion. But ultimately, it is her CHOICE to dress like a whore, yes?

Just like, in this day and age we appear as a nation and society to have lost all bearing on any moral compass when it comes to buying dolls called &quot;Bratz&quot; for little girls that are dressed like a Paedophile&#039;s wet dream.

Does my view of the &quot;Bratz&quot; dolls offend you? Does is seem somewhat over-zealous and reactionary?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike - please take a moment to read my email again because you will notice the word &#8220;if&#8221; - I was trying to demonstrate to you that people can be upset by the merest difference in opinion and language.  I was NOT saying that women who where make-up and mini-skirts are whores but was asking how people would react if I were to do so because that is exactly how I felt about Polly Toynbee saying that the Niqab is oppressive and sinister.  Words have a lot of power, Mr Martlet, so before you tell me to go back to where I came from, try reading my email properly and within the context I wrote it.  I could ask you where you are from?  Do you know?</p>

<p>Here is the text to which you refer:</p>

<p>&#8220;&#8230;IF I were to say that all women who wear make-up, high-heels and mini-skirts are whores and bound to be raped, perhaps many might feel I was a) a prude b) unsophisticated or c) unable to comprehend a woman&#8217;s sense of fashion. But ultimately, it is her CHOICE to dress like a whore, yes?</p>

<p>Just like, in this day and age we appear as a nation and society to have lost all bearing on any moral compass when it comes to buying dolls called &#8220;Bratz&#8221; for little girls that are dressed like a Paedophile&#8217;s wet dream.</p>

<p>Does my view of the &#8220;Bratz&#8221; dolls offend you? Does is seem somewhat over-zealous and reactionary?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Mike Martlet</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4157</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Martlet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Oct 2006 22:21:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4157</guid>
		<description>To Hazera Forth,

Make-up, high heels and mini skirts are normal attire in our society and have been so on and off for about 40 years; they are not the mark of a whore!

What right do you have to criticize our developed modern society by using the standards of your alien backward medieval and dictatorial religion? Your standards are not absolutes, they are merely an archaic set of rules drawn up by males who can&#039;t control their sexual urges and don&#039;t want to take responsibility for that themselves. They thus put the blame on women in the same way that the Puritan preacher did in the Salem Witch Trials.

I find your attitude quite offensive; if you don&#039;t like our culture get off back to where you came from!
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To Hazera Forth,</p>

<p>Make-up, high heels and mini skirts are normal attire in our society and have been so on and off for about 40 years; they are not the mark of a whore!</p>

<p>What right do you have to criticize our developed modern society by using the standards of your alien backward medieval and dictatorial religion? Your standards are not absolutes, they are merely an archaic set of rules drawn up by males who can&#8217;t control their sexual urges and don&#8217;t want to take responsibility for that themselves. They thus put the blame on women in the same way that the Puritan preacher did in the Salem Witch Trials.</p>

<p>I find your attitude quite offensive; if you don&#8217;t like our culture get off back to where you came from!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Abu ali al-Nejad</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4156</link>
		<dc:creator>Abu ali al-Nejad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Oct 2006 19:08:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4156</guid>
		<description>Assalaamu alaikum,
Just few more words and facts about Saira Khan and her ideas of being the &quot;role model for moderate Muslims&quot;:
1- she openly drinks alcohol;
2- she shakes hands with men;
3- she never goes to mosque;
4- she is married to a kuffar (non muslim) !!!!

and her list of sins is by no means exhaustive.

In a few words, she is nothing but the worst enemy of Islam.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Assalaamu alaikum,
Just few more words and facts about Saira Khan and her ideas of being the &#8220;role model for moderate Muslims&#8221;:
1- she openly drinks alcohol;
2- she shakes hands with men;
3- she never goes to mosque;
4- she is married to a kuffar (non muslim) !!!!</p>

<p>and her list of sins is by no means exhaustive.</p>

<p>In a few words, she is nothing but the worst enemy of Islam.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Thersites</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4155</link>
		<dc:creator>Thersites</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Oct 2006 10:23:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4155</guid>
		<description>&quot;Ms Azmi later admitted she had taken the veil off to be interviewed for the job by a male governor. &quot;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Ms Azmi later admitted she had taken the veil off to be interviewed for the job by a male governor. &#8220;</p>
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		<title>By: Ann</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4154</link>
		<dc:creator>Ann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Oct 2006 18:36:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4154</guid>
		<description>Assalaamu alaikum,

About the teacher who supposedly wouldn&#039;t take the veil off in front of her students...

&lt;a href=&quot;http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/bradford/6050392.stm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/bradford/6050392.stm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/bradford/6050392.stm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

...Disputing the school&#039;s version of events, she insisted she had always been willing to take off her veil in front of the children but would not in front of male colleagues.

She said she had taught in class without the veil when there were no males present...
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Assalaamu alaikum,</p>

<p>About the teacher who supposedly wouldn&#8217;t take the veil off in front of her students&#8230;</p>

<p><a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/bradford/6050392.stm"></a><a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/bradford/6050392.stm">http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/bradford/6050392.stm</a></p>

<p>&#8230;Disputing the school&#8217;s version of events, she insisted she had always been willing to take off her veil in front of the children but would not in front of male colleagues.</p>

<p>She said she had taught in class without the veil when there were no males present&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Thersites</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4153</link>
		<dc:creator>Thersites</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Oct 2006 16:49:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4153</guid>
		<description>&quot;As far as I know, however, except in science fiction, no-one is threatened with hell for not wearing the right kind of clothing...

Basically, you are trying to say here, why would anyone go to hell simply for not wearing the right kind of clothing ?

Basically, you are being sarcastic?

It is not about wearing a particular type of clothing that would get people into hell. Rather, it is the way they nurture their souls before death.

However, it is very difficult to nurture your soul without a belief and/or performing an action (including wearing a particular type of clothing).

So for example, if you believe that you were created by a Creator and that He is your Master, Friend, Guardian, etc, your soul will be nurtured by such beliefs - in a particular way that would be different if you believe otherwise.

Of course, that&#039;s if you believe is the existence of a soul. If you don&#039;t believe in a soul then your beliefs and/or action goes to waste when you body dies. Really?

Anyhow,...if you go on to do actions such as wear a particular type of clothing because you believe your Master requires of you (forget whether the belief is true or not), the forementioned configuration of your soul would be reinforced and consolidated - by such an action. And so on.

Now, when you die, you would find your soul just as you have nurtured it. In fact you don&#039;t need to die before discovering its status, but the distraction here makes it difficult.

Anyway, when the material whithers away and everything is barebone, you would discover yourself and see how you really look in your new soul form (whatever form that is).

If for example you look big, i.e. big ego as a result of iconoclastic nourishment, unfortunately there would be no space for you - because Allah would have necessarily taken up all the Space: If we could talk in these terms.

So, you would have to disappear, but it won&#039;t be possible. innakum makithoon - 43:77.

So, you would have to burn perpetually (not you, God Forbid). Burn is an understatement here. Hell (just like Paradise) is indescribable. Basically, you would have to be put out continuously.

On the other hand, if you manage to come small, i.e. with a soul configured as nothing, no ego, no airs, due to the right nourishment - right beliefs, right actions. In this case, you would be able to associate with Anything you want. Even where there is no space, nothingness always have its way.

That is just a metaphor.

Few words are usually enough for the perspicuous, more would only confuse the dull-witted.

Try to ask questions as opposed to positioning yourself as an intellectual Umpire and ridiculing religious practises thereby.&quot;

Eh?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;As far as I know, however, except in science fiction, no-one is threatened with hell for not wearing the right kind of clothing&#8230;</p>

<p>Basically, you are trying to say here, why would anyone go to hell simply for not wearing the right kind of clothing ?</p>

<p>Basically, you are being sarcastic?</p>

<p>It is not about wearing a particular type of clothing that would get people into hell. Rather, it is the way they nurture their souls before death.</p>

<p>However, it is very difficult to nurture your soul without a belief and/or performing an action (including wearing a particular type of clothing).</p>

<p>So for example, if you believe that you were created by a Creator and that He is your Master, Friend, Guardian, etc, your soul will be nurtured by such beliefs - in a particular way that would be different if you believe otherwise.</p>

<p>Of course, that&#8217;s if you believe is the existence of a soul. If you don&#8217;t believe in a soul then your beliefs and/or action goes to waste when you body dies. Really?</p>

<p>Anyhow,&#8230;if you go on to do actions such as wear a particular type of clothing because you believe your Master requires of you (forget whether the belief is true or not), the forementioned configuration of your soul would be reinforced and consolidated - by such an action. And so on.</p>

<p>Now, when you die, you would find your soul just as you have nurtured it. In fact you don&#8217;t need to die before discovering its status, but the distraction here makes it difficult.</p>

<p>Anyway, when the material whithers away and everything is barebone, you would discover yourself and see how you really look in your new soul form (whatever form that is).</p>

<p>If for example you look big, i.e. big ego as a result of iconoclastic nourishment, unfortunately there would be no space for you - because Allah would have necessarily taken up all the Space: If we could talk in these terms.</p>

<p>So, you would have to disappear, but it won&#8217;t be possible. innakum makithoon - 43:77.</p>

<p>So, you would have to burn perpetually (not you, God Forbid). Burn is an understatement here. Hell (just like Paradise) is indescribable. Basically, you would have to be put out continuously.</p>

<p>On the other hand, if you manage to come small, i.e. with a soul configured as nothing, no ego, no airs, due to the right nourishment - right beliefs, right actions. In this case, you would be able to associate with Anything you want. Even where there is no space, nothingness always have its way.</p>

<p>That is just a metaphor.</p>

<p>Few words are usually enough for the perspicuous, more would only confuse the dull-witted.</p>

<p>Try to ask questions as opposed to positioning yourself as an intellectual Umpire and ridiculing religious practises thereby.&#8221;</p>

<p>Eh?</p>
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		<title>By: Timewaster</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4152</link>
		<dc:creator>Timewaster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Oct 2006 13:36:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4152</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;As far as I know, however, except in science fiction, no-one is threatened with hell for not wearing the right kind of clothing... &lt;/i&gt;

Basically, you are trying to say here, why would anyone go to hell simply for not wearing the right kind of clothing ?

Basically, you are being sarcastic?

It is not about wearing a particular type of clothing that would get people into hell.  Rather, it is the way they nurture their souls before death.

However, it is very difficult to nurture your soul without a belief and/or performing an action (including wearing a particular type of clothing).

So for example, if you believe that you were created by a Creator and that He is your Master, Friend, Guardian, etc, your soul will be nurtured by such beliefs - in a particular way that would be different if you believe otherwise.

Of course, that&#039;s if you believe is the existence of a soul.
If you don&#039;t believe in a soul then your beliefs and/or action goes to waste when you body dies.  Really?

Anyhow,...if you go on to do actions such as wear a particular type of clothing &lt;b&gt;because&lt;/b&gt; you believe your Master requires of you (forget whether the belief is true or not), the forementioned configuration of your soul would be reinforced and consolidated - by such an action.  And so on.

Now, when you die, you would find your soul just as you have nurtured it.
In fact you don&#039;t need to die before discovering its status, but the distraction &lt;i&gt;here&lt;/i&gt; makes it difficult.

Anyway, when the material whithers away and everything is barebone, you would discover yourself and see how you really look in your new soul form (whatever form that is).

If for example you look big, i.e. big ego as a result of iconoclastic nourishment, unfortunately there would be no space for you - because Allah would have necessarily taken up all the Space: If we could talk in these terms.

So, you would have to &lt;i&gt;disappear&lt;/i&gt;, but it won&#039;t be possible. &lt;i&gt;innakum makithoon&lt;/i&gt; - 43:77.

So, you would have to burn perpetually (not you, God Forbid).
Burn is an understatement here.  Hell (just like Paradise) is indescribable. Basically, you would have to be put out continuously.

On the other hand, if you manage to come small, i.e. with a soul configured as nothing, no ego, no airs, due to the right nourishment - right beliefs, right actions. In this case, you would be able to associate with Anything you want.  Even where there is no space, nothingness always have its way.

That is just a metaphor.

Few words are usually enough for the perspicuous, more would only confuse the dull-witted.

Try to ask questions as opposed to positioning yourself as an intellectual Umpire and ridiculing religious practises thereby.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>As far as I know, however, except in science fiction, no-one is threatened with hell for not wearing the right kind of clothing&#8230; </i></p>

<p>Basically, you are trying to say here, why would anyone go to hell simply for not wearing the right kind of clothing ?</p>

<p>Basically, you are being sarcastic?</p>

<p>It is not about wearing a particular type of clothing that would get people into hell.  Rather, it is the way they nurture their souls before death.</p>

<p>However, it is very difficult to nurture your soul without a belief and/or performing an action (including wearing a particular type of clothing).</p>

<p>So for example, if you believe that you were created by a Creator and that He is your Master, Friend, Guardian, etc, your soul will be nurtured by such beliefs - in a particular way that would be different if you believe otherwise.</p>

<p>Of course, that&#8217;s if you believe is the existence of a soul.
If you don&#8217;t believe in a soul then your beliefs and/or action goes to waste when you body dies.  Really?</p>

<p>Anyhow,&#8230;if you go on to do actions such as wear a particular type of clothing <b>because</b> you believe your Master requires of you (forget whether the belief is true or not), the forementioned configuration of your soul would be reinforced and consolidated - by such an action.  And so on.</p>

<p>Now, when you die, you would find your soul just as you have nurtured it.
In fact you don&#8217;t need to die before discovering its status, but the distraction <i>here</i> makes it difficult.</p>

<p>Anyway, when the material whithers away and everything is barebone, you would discover yourself and see how you really look in your new soul form (whatever form that is).</p>

<p>If for example you look big, i.e. big ego as a result of iconoclastic nourishment, unfortunately there would be no space for you - because Allah would have necessarily taken up all the Space: If we could talk in these terms.</p>

<p>So, you would have to <i>disappear</i>, but it won&#8217;t be possible. <i>innakum makithoon</i> - 43:77.</p>

<p>So, you would have to burn perpetually (not you, God Forbid).
Burn is an understatement here.  Hell (just like Paradise) is indescribable. Basically, you would have to be put out continuously.</p>

<p>On the other hand, if you manage to come small, i.e. with a soul configured as nothing, no ego, no airs, due to the right nourishment - right beliefs, right actions. In this case, you would be able to associate with Anything you want.  Even where there is no space, nothingness always have its way.</p>

<p>That is just a metaphor.</p>

<p>Few words are usually enough for the perspicuous, more would only confuse the dull-witted.</p>

<p>Try to ask questions as opposed to positioning yourself as an intellectual Umpire and ridiculing religious practises thereby.</p>
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		<title>By: Ann</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4151</link>
		<dc:creator>Ann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Oct 2006 03:38:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4151</guid>
		<description>Assalaamu alaikum,

I looked at that BBC report... I don&#039;t know anything else about that case, but going by what they say there, I don&#039;t understand why she can&#039;t lift the niqab in front of children. A lot of teachers in my children&#039;s school wear niqab, but not in the classroom, unless a man has to come in for something.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Assalaamu alaikum,</p>

<p>I looked at that BBC report&#8230; I don&#8217;t know anything else about that case, but going by what they say there, I don&#8217;t understand why she can&#8217;t lift the niqab in front of children. A lot of teachers in my children&#8217;s school wear niqab, but not in the classroom, unless a man has to come in for something.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: synonym</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4150</link>
		<dc:creator>synonym</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Oct 2006 10:17:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4150</guid>
		<description>Talk about being conditioned NOT to wear a veil:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bradford/6046992.stm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bradford/6046992.stm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bradford/6046992.stm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/a&gt;

Threat of social exclusion?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Talk about being conditioned NOT to wear a veil:</p>

<p><a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bradford/6046992.stm"></a><a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bradford/6046992.stm">http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/bradford/6046992.stm</a></p>

<p>Threat of social exclusion?</p>
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		<title>By: Thersites</title>
		<link>http://www.blogistan.co.uk/blog/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4149</link>
		<dc:creator>Thersites</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Oct 2006 09:37:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.blogistan.co.uk/ijwp/mt.php/2006/10/09/more_on_the_niqab_situation#comment-4149</guid>
		<description>Politicians, bankers and lawyers are not conditioned to wear suits and ties, any more than soldiers are conditioned to wear uniforms. They are not put into them at an early age or threatened throughout their childhood with what will happen if they do not wear them. They have decided as adults that, for the purposes the aim for, that particular clothing will best serve their ends. If they decide they no longer espouse the beliefs they expressed by dressing as they do they can stop wearing them withouit opprobium or violent repurcussions.

If you look at any organisation concerned with the effects of the media- advertising especially- on people, including children, you will find a great deal of concern with the effects of childhood conditioning. As far as I know, however, except in science fiction, no-one is threatened with hell for not wearing the right kind of clothing by advertisers or physically attacked for failing to do so.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Politicians, bankers and lawyers are not conditioned to wear suits and ties, any more than soldiers are conditioned to wear uniforms. They are not put into them at an early age or threatened throughout their childhood with what will happen if they do not wear them. They have decided as adults that, for the purposes the aim for, that particular clothing will best serve their ends. If they decide they no longer espouse the beliefs they expressed by dressing as they do they can stop wearing them withouit opprobium or violent repurcussions.</p>

<p>If you look at any organisation concerned with the effects of the media- advertising especially- on people, including children, you will find a great deal of concern with the effects of childhood conditioning. As far as I know, however, except in science fiction, no-one is threatened with hell for not wearing the right kind of clothing by advertisers or physically attacked for failing to do so.</p>
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