Technorati Tags: mpacuk, women only jihad, channel 4, dispatches, muslim women
I had been eagerly anticipating Channel 4’s Dispatches programme Women Only Jihad, which follows a group of female activists from the Muslim Public Affairs Committee as they fight to get admission to various mosques. One of these is in Ilford, Essex, and the other in Blackburn, Lancashire. The issue of women’s access to mosques is a major issue throughout the Muslim communities in both the UK and USA; Sara Umm Zaid has written about it many times, including about one incident (also here) where she and some friends were physically barred from entering by some rather unfriendly men. More recently, given the disgusting conditions of some women’s areas in mosques (Safiyyah Ally has an entry on one in Saudi Arabia, but the same situation is to be found in the West too), some women, including UZ, have changed their position to support women praying in the main prayer area behind a curtain. In a number of mosques, however, there simply is no facility and women are simply not allowed entry, which is something the girls from MPACUK were seeking to remedy. (More: Osama Saeed.)
The reason many mosques run by immigrants from the Indian subcontinent refuse to admit women is the same as that for which most mosques in Pakistan, probably among other places, do the same: they regard the mosque as the men’s space, on the grounds that Sayyiduna Omar, radhi Allahu ‘anhu, decided to stop women praying in the mosque on the grounds that the women in his time were not behaving appropriately. There is also the well-known fact that a woman’s prayer is more meritorious when conducted in private, preferably in the most private part of the woman’s home. There are a host of reasons why many people demand that women be admitted to mosques, including that a woman may be far from her home and still need someone to pray (such as when shopping or attending college), and a prayer offered in a mosque is vastly more private than one offered in the only other places available: the street, or the public park. There may be reasons why a woman cannot pray at home: it may be shared with, or owned by, hostile non-Muslims or there may be no peace and quiet there.
For these reasons and others, there are good reasons why women might demand space in mosques to pray. Since prayer in a mosque is compulsory for men living nearby and not for the women, and because attending the Jumu’ah prayer is obligatory for men and not for women, there are good reasons why the women’s space is nowhere near most of the mosque’s space, but it should at least be there. However, given past experience, I had doubts about what sort of approach the MPACUK women would take, and my suspicions proved to be justified.
The women’s approach was to doorstep the mosque, accompanied by a Channel 4 camera crew, and demand to be admitted to pray. The men at the mosque in Balfour Road in Ilford, unsurprisingly, refused them access, were hostile to the film crew which seemed to have appeared unannounced, and slammed the door in the women’s faces. At a mosque in Blackburn, their attempts had a similar result, and eventually an elderly man reasoned with them by telling them that the other men will not allow them, and that they should give up and go home.
MPACUK proceeded to take the matter up with the Muslim Council of Britain and the Lancashire Council of Mosques, and in a meeting with the latter, the limitations of the MPACUK approach to this, and to everything, became clear. Some of the MPACUK people, including the well-known Asghar Bukhari, proved unable to discuss the issue calmly and reasonably, instead talking over those with whom they were supposed to be negotiating. The talks degenerated into a shouting match. As on so many other occasions, he proved to be his usual hot-headed, blustering self, demonstrating once again that he’s in no position to represent the Muslim community or even to be anywhere near where sensitive negotiations are going on.
The mosque agreed to let the ladies into the mosque, but on their way from the LCM meeting to the mosque, they were met by a group of the brothers from the mosque and shown into the mosque’s ladies’ annexe, which they did not film but showed the ladies coming out, telling the world that they had not prayed because the conditions inside were filthy and smelly, which is quite believable given what has been written about women’s spaces elsewhere. It then turned out, however, that that mosque was allowing women in to hear the sermons in Ramadan, which begs the question of why they did not simply join them (unless they were not being provided with spaces to pray). There was also a house which was used by local Muslim women for prayer and teaching, so it is not true that there are simply no facilities for women in the area.
Two further issues must be raised regarding this programme. The first is that several of the women were not wearing proper hijab, by which I mean that hair was showing or that their scarves were thin enough to show the colour of their hair. Normally I would not criticise a Muslim woman who appeared in the media for this, because it is so common, but here it undermined any claim that this was a campaign by religious women, not “Islamic feminists” of the Asra No’mani type, seeking access to the mosque to fulfil religious duties. In addition, these women were demanding admission to the mosque for salaat, and salaat is not valid for a woman unless her hair is covered.
Second, the Balfour Road mosque is actually just a few streets away from Ilford’s own Albert Road mosque (you can see for yourself on this street map; the Balfour Road mosque is located roughly where the red and yellow arrow is, while Albert Road is the next road south from Winston Way), and Albert Road mosque, which is bigger, has always admitted women although it only opened in 1996 (women are also admitted to the mosques in Eton Road and Woodford Avenue). Access to Balfour Road is not exactly the most pressing of needs - perhaps they might have found one that is not a stone’s throw from a nice new mosque which does admit them? There are, in addition, ten mosques (including one run by Shi’ites) in Blackburn which admit women which are listed in the Muslim Directory (as of the 2004-5 edition), although there are depressingly many in that town which have no facilities for women, including one with space for 3,500 men.
In short, this programme was a useful guide to how not to campaign for better facilities for Muslim women. It showed the women as overly aggressive and confrontational, although it gave no indication of whether the women had approached the mosques concerned about gaining access. As a sister wrote on DeenPort this evening, “you don’t get a group of sisters to gatecrash jummah and cause havoc like that and expect to be listened to”. If it is necessary to force the issue, it cannot be done with just a handful of women from outside town turning up unannounced; you need a large contingent of the town’s own Muslim women to descend on the mosque, having forewarned the management of what will be happening.
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“It showed the women as overly aggressive and confrontational”
Sadly I think the MPAC people take their lead from Asghar Bukhari. I’ve noticed that the people who comment and post on the MPAC web site are often overly agressive as well.
People may quote the hadiths which indicate the preference for women to pray in their homes. But in my view, considering the nature of this society, it is even MORE important that Muslim women have access to a strong community facility for their spiritual and other needs.
The argument about fitnah just doesn’t cut it, sorry. Fitnah is out there, and you can’t avoid it by shutting out sisters, or shutting them in the home. Indeed, that will make the situation worse.
I’ve come across a post on the MPACUK Discussion Board.
Aren’t you the individual who went to the Zionists about MPACUK’s elections or something?
Every Muslim who watched that program agrees with me .If these women from MPACUK were fighting for the rights of women they should presented themselves first in appropriate Islamic clothing.(I mean full hijab and abaya or Jelbab)respect yourself then you will get respected from others. Women are suppose to be shy and look down not to confront men in front of a camera and start shouting and laugh about it later. We women should take examples of mother of the believes, what was there ways of solving problems.
Yes! We see there is a problem, there is no space for women in the mosques. “Is there a space for women but the men don’t won’t women to pray there” or “there is no space in the mosques for women, a lot of men come to pray and they don’t have extra space.” Follow the right procedure and send decent women who have manners and shame to talk to the elders. Not women who are fighting for equal rights between men and women and they want to nominate a woman imam(subhanallah).This is one of the signs of ghiyamah.The women from MPACUK wanted only their side to be heard and judged from that.
Sohaib you wanted to know the narration here it is: These women from MPACUK is what Aisha (r.a) meant.
Sahih bukhari No.829 Narrated Aisha (The wife of the Prophet saw) Had Allah’s Apostle known what the women were doing, he would have forbidden them from going to the mosque as the women of Bani Israel had been forbidden. Yahya bin Said (a sub-narrator) asked ‘Amra (another sub-narrator), “Were the women of Bani Israel forbidden?” She replied “Yes.”
+These women from MPACUK is what Aisha (r.a) meant. If women behave badly they will be forbidden to enter a holy place.
There Quran and sunnah of the Prophet saw doesn’t forbide women to go to the mosque. For women it is preferable to pray in your home. The prophet (saw) told the companions not to refuse their wives to go to the mosque.
Sahih bukhari No.833-Narrated Salim bin Abdullah My father said, “The Prophet said, ‘If the wife of any one of you asks permission (to go to the mosque) do not forbid her.”
Sahih Bukhari No.856 Narrated Ibn Umar One of the wives of Umar (bin Al-Khattab) used to offer the Fajr and the ‘Isha’ prayer in congregation in the mosque. She was asked why she had come out for the prayer as she knew that Umar disliked it, and he has great ghaira (self-respect). She replied, “What prevents him from stopping me from this act?” The other replied, “The statement of Allah’s Apostle (SallAllaahu `Alayhi Wa Sallam) : ‘Do not stop Allah’s women-slave from going to Allah s mosques’ prevents him.”
Our Prophet told us that the angels stand at the gate of the mosque and keep on writing the names of the people coming to pray for jumua prayer.
Sahih bukhari No.833-Narrated Salim bin Abdullah The Prophet said, “When it is a Friday, the angels stand at the gate of the mosque and keep on writing the names of the persons coming to the mosque in succession according to their arrivals. The example of the one who enters the mosque in the earliest hour is that of one offering a camel (in sacrifice). The one coming next is like one offering a cow and then a ram and then a chicken and then an egg respectively. When the Imam comes out (for Jumua prayer) they (i.e. angels) fold their papers and listen to the Khutba.”
We also want to be on the list of the angels inshaallah but if there is no women side in the mosques let go to the other mosques that allows women and until something will be done. Asalam aleikum
i think the above comment and this article amounts to backbiting. You are making all sorts of assumptions and neglecting to mention that mpac as i have read on their site wrote letters/had a petition/requested meetings with these mosques, it was the men from the mosques that abused them why not object to their behaviour? The men were swearing and threatening violence. is that acceptable?
And every muslim i know liked the documentary, it really challenged stereotypes and showed that muslims are trying to improve their own community.
As for commenting on their dress how small minded they were in hijab, modest clothing/jilbab and niqab (that didnt stop her getting shouted at) i didnt see any transparent scarves or immodest clothing why were people looking so closely? To make such offensive comments, to look for things to attack the sisters on…such a shame. No mention of mpacs good work or intentions.
no mention of the other good points like the concerns of the sisters in the women refuge or the points made by the sisters that were learning/doing good in mosques they had been allowed in….
Utbah what do you mean about zionists?
Zayba if these women wrote letter and were not replied,they should send men there without the channel 4 who exposed Islamic issues on air. Do you see other religions do these?
They went to the mosque on Friday prayers with camera an announced, they wanted these reactions to be filmed and that is what they did. If the men were shouting, why did they shout back? That is what I am talking about.They should not have done what they did on camera ,it is degrading Muslim women and their morals. We had some sister who were wearing hijab with trousers and blouses that shows their chest (the sister in red blouse) What did you want the men to do, invite them in the mosque and have decent conversation with them. They were not decent themselves. Some sister manshaallah were covered but the others made it worse for them.
The old man took them a side and warned them but they did not want to listern.They just wanted to make a farce.
ok then place the blame directly on the sisters and focus on their blouses and trousers not the issue..i just dont get it. I see sisters in hijab being active you seem to see women you wish to nitpick about and degrade….we have enough non-muslims moaning about the way sisters dress you are doing the same and i just dont see how that helps anyone.
Secondly i read a lot of accounts on the mpac site they are collected under the women in Islam section and i spoke to an mpacer last year who told me about their mosques campaigns and the sorts of complaints they get about mosques not accomodating women etc actually mpac have a 12 point plan this is all part of that they have been speaking to these mosques for a long time and have gone their without cameras and still been abused. Please get some persepctive the documentary was not the whole story.
You and Yusuf make really personal comments and seem to have a problem with mpac do you know anything else about them pls check out their site they have a section on green muslims and voting, they deal with all kinds of issues and i respond to their media alerts i think they have done good work more work than any other org that i know of….but you only see the sisters chest which wasnt covered enough for you…see i dont see that as a major problem of the ummah….huh…
“And every muslim i know liked the documentary, it really challenged stereotypes and showed that muslims are trying to improve their own community.”
http://www.mpacuk.org/content/view/2927/34/
They have 179 comments so far and it seems there are far more negative ones about the programme than positive ones.
I don’t think it challenged the sterotypes but rather confirmed stereotypes particularly regarding the men who control mosques.
Zayba, the problem was the entire approach the women took. It was sad that the men and women were shouting at each other in front of a camera for the entire non-muslim nation to see. Is this the way sensible Muslims get their way - to try and disgrace the other group to the whole nation? It would have been far better to just have had sensible talks with the mosque leaders, possibly involving scholars, at a time when it was convenient for them to do so.
Also I noticed that some of the men were praying jummah outside the mosque. That obviously shows there is not enough praying space in the mosque.
Do the sisters really think that even more men should be thrown out just to fit the women when it isn’t even compulosry for the women but it for the men?
Far better for the women to donate money to the mosque and help them build extensions to get more space so both more men and women can pray.
Asalamu alaykum,
I just downloaded and viewed the program and I think the negative comments are unjustified. Women should be allowed to pray in every masjid and certainly should not be prevented or attacked for wanting to pray. The approach could have be different but so what?
Personally, I would have preferred the sisters to come out for fajr and isha first before the jumuah but the fact remains sisters are unjustly and physically prevented from praying in some of the masajid. One more reason I would not want to live in the UK but if I was there I would be right there fighting with them. May Allah grant them success in opening the masajid for the sisters. Ameen.
I think that sister Kamilah made some excellent points: If they had just used a better approach, who knows, the men might have been swayed perhaps even a little bit, which would have insha’Allah led to more openings and opportunities for the sisters to get the men to understand their requests.
This way, it seems that there is just going to be more tension and aggression between the brothers and sisters, and more fitnah than anything else.
May Allah guide us all to the Correct Way and make us successful in this world and in the Hereafter, ameen!
Those who criticize the clothing of the women in the documentary are putting themselves alongside the likes of Jack Straw, Nonie Darwish, and al-Hilali.
Rather than deal with the issues at hand and respect women as intelligent individuals capable of making choices these people say that if you want us to listen to you or take your arguments seriously you must first conform to our preconceived norms, culture, and modes of dress.
As-Salaamu ‘alaikum,
MA: I watched the programme and have been following MPACUK for a few years, and the tactics and behaviour, and the lax hijab, are perfectly consistent with what I’ve seen of them in person and online. They (the men far worse than the women) do not behave as rational individuals, they expect people to just behave as they want them to, they display totally un-Islamic behaviour such as cursing the Muslims in Blackburn for voting for Jack Straw and insulting people with language like “pacified muppet”, and they do not respond positively to criticism of their behaviour. As far as they are concerned, people who criticise them just don’t get it.
As for the women and their hijab, I wasn’t calling for them to dress in long black shifts with niqab, but for them to wear the proper dress when approaching conservative Muslims to demand prayer space and access to the mosque, because it’s appropriate dress for the mosque and because prayer is invalid for a woman without it. I support the right of a woman to have mosque prayer space, but that campaign is just an embarrassment to those who demand it.
Walaykum Salaam Yusuf, I’ amazed at your following MPACUK for the few years. You followed them so much that you started to spy on them for the Zionist’s. I have not come across any comment or reply as to why you went to the Zionists and provided them with inside information about MPACUK’s internal matters. Didn’t they entrust you as a Muslim with that information, and you broke that trust by going into bed with the ZIonists? Yusuf, Jack Straw gave the go ahead for F16 to Israel, Jack Straw’s support for the war has killed over 500,000, as a result of his comments on niqab our Sisters have been attacked, little children in their prams have been spat at and your looking at their small little misgivings. Your actually worse than those Zionists who always keep smearing them via their blogging about MPACUK. I have met a few Brothers via the Global Peace & Unity event, and you state that the men are far worse. You are using double standards here. You can label all the Brothers in MPAC as “irrational individuals” and you condemn MPACUK for calling those who support the MP’s which harm the Muslim Ummah around the world. I’m not going to ask what is worse in your eye’s as I can see from the posts and your “dislike” about MPACUK what you would say.
I hope you can come out openly as to where you stand on other issue’s which MPACUK have raised such as Women on Committee Board, the educational aspect and social matters for Muslim women.
Utbah: I did not “run to the Zionists” with “inside information about MPACUK’s internal matters”, but I merely mentioned in the publicly readable comments pages of one particular well-known blog that they were having an election soon, which I hardly considered to be top-secret information. It is never a secret when an organisation has an election. I have never spied on MPACUK for anyone, so get your facts right. I also have never objected to the idea of women coming into mosques and the other ideas you mention; what I object to is the way MPACUK take up matters with their fellow Muslims.
Thank you Yusuf for answering the questions.
Which blog was this?
“I have never spied on MPACUK for anyone, so get your facts right.”
I have made that statement from your own actions, not myself or asghars.
“It is never a secret when an organisation has an election.”
Are you really having a laugh? Did you know the MP which MPACUK took out was going to stand for BICOM? Do you know when AIPAC has their elections?
When it comes to an organisation which is defending the Muslim Community, it’s internal matters stays internal. No external (especially Zionist organisaitons) have no right to know about it.
They say MCB does represent Muslim, who the hell asked them to speak who represents the Muslim Community?
“what I object to is the way MPACUK take up matters with their fellow Muslims.”
Yes, we can agree and disagree on these matters. But the reality is our Sisters are turning to prostitution because our Mosques are not opening their doors to these women. Isn’t that sick? The servants of Allah turning to prostitution to make their living because they have family problems? Our youth are blowing us up in our own country. Isn’t that sickening? Mosques still do not represent or have anyone who represents the Muslim youth. Why is that.
Those Mosque’s which turn a blind eye to our communities problems must be challenged. If you care so much about the Ummah. Why don’t you write up an action plan and implement one so you can show it to MPACUK that it has been tried and tested. How about that?
” have been following MPACUK for a few years, and the tactics and behaviour, and the lax hijab, are perfectly consistent with what I’ve seen of them in person and online.”
How long have you been following them Yusuf? Are you saying bad behaviour and lax hijab are characteristic of MPAC members? Have you inspected/met everyone of them? Have you inspected every sister and her hijab? I think your above statement amounts to back biting…as far as i can tell from your posts you have only met with some mpacers once or twicw and you reported on that meeting to the Zionist website Engage before that you had complained about them many times….as Utbah says. By all means mpac should be critiqued indeed they hightlight the importance of accountability so they should expect to be held accountable. However accountability and constructive criticism are very different to insults: by accusing the sisters of lax hijab and the all the men of bad behaviour you are insulting/generalising mpac previously you have described them as clowns and morons and ‘two sandwiches short of a picnic’: these are insults and very offensive.
Nor have you ever mentioned any of tyhe good work they have done the alerts they have written, the enemies of Islam they have refuted, the campaigns they have highlighted, they even posted one of your articles on site and gave you publicity but all you do is call them names and question their iman.
I would ask brothers and sisters to read the mpac site and make up their own minds and not listen to back biting: i think i should mention something positive about mpac i really liked their 12 point plan as did my mosque:
http://www.mpacuk.org/content/view/663/39/
Actually, I was more critical of the film itself than MPACUK, although I felt there were faults in their approach:
http://anarchomuslim.blogspot......itual.html